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Podcast Goodness: Brainwashing and Twinkies!
July 10, 2009
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Good morning sunshine! This week on the Stuff You Should Know podcast, Herr Clark and yours truly did a little science thing and then something for fun — brainwashing and Twinkies.
Brainwashing was a good one, chock full of brain facts and examples in history of people being brainwashed. We broke down the steps you take when brainwashing someone and I gotta say, it does kind of make sense how this could work. We also did a little role playing and Josh attempted to rid me of what he sees as my hipster persona. Little does he know that I’m far from a hipster — there’s an age limit on that kind of thing. We also talked a bit about cults and have already received an email correction that the folks at Jonestown actually drank Flavor-Aid and not Kool-Aid. Unfortunately for Kool-Aid, all that matters is how people remember it.
Yesterday’s show was just a bit of fun about Twinkies. We rarely do something so light and goofy and it was a good time for us, so thanks for indulging. There was a little bit of science thrown in, namely that Twinkies aren’t the egg, milk and butter treats they were when they first came on the scene in the 1930s. Now it’s mostly about chemical ingredients. We also learned that no, Twinkies do not have a shelf life that stretches into the decades, pure urban myth.
Thanks for tuning in, folks. Thanks also to Parallax Kodachrome for his addition to the blog this week — as he calls it, “Chuck n Josh, Estonian Hall n Oates.” Pure goodness.
So chime in, people. Have you ever had an experience with a cult? Any good Twinkie stories out there?
Read:
How Cults Work
How Brainwashing Works
How Twinkies Work
Comments
24 Responses to “Podcast Goodness: Brainwashing and Twinkies!”
Scott says: Great Twinkies podcast! I almost fell out of my chair laughing. My co-workers think I’m nuts. I just wanted to remind your vegetarian and vegan readers, listeners, and friends that they shouldn’t be eating Twinkies (or most Hostess products for that matter) at all because they’re made with vegetable and/or animal shortening. That means LARD! Anyway, keep up the fantastic podcasts!
harrisonambs says: I remember hearing about these restaurants in New York that recreated Little Debbie and Hostess snacks using really high-end ingredients. I wanted to have a link to some of these, but Google has failed me. Like it has in so many other ways…
So I leave you with a recipe from one of my favorite sites (Recipezaar):
http://www.recipezaar.com/Homemade-Twinkies-110009
You read that right. Homemade Twinkies. The shape would be the hard part, but I can’t imagine breaking into a Twinkie factory to be that hard.
Pepe Silvia says: Well, let’s say this Twinkie represents the normal amount of psychokinetic energy in the New York area. Based on this morning’s reading, it would be a Twinkie thirty-five feet long, weighing approximately six hundred pounds.
Josh – did you sell fried twinkies at the EAV beer fest? If so, I was a very satisfied customer.
Josh/Chuck,
I was glad to hear, in the wake of tha passing of so many American icons, that the twinkie (an icon in itself) holds strong and will do so for years to come. Also, I would like to request that more podcasts be done within the confines of the twinkie factory. Nothing accompanies a podcast full of information better than the sounds of cream filling being injected into cake. Excellent work on your producer’s end. Thanks again and keep them coming!
hello. thanks for doing the brainwashing podcast at my suggestion. I did not feel the need to email again as I have no new commentary to add. definitely I still feel that the “need for cognition” trait is what defines a person’s resistance to brainwashability. these are the ones who escape from cults who go on to write books about it. i think most “religious” type cults whether they claim to be based on christianism or not utilize these steps to create loyal followers.
I’ll quote what I wrote in relation to the topic prior to your doing the podcast:
“Around when the podcasts started mentioning the superstuffed guide I grabbed it as well to try and hear it in chronological order relative to the remaining podcasts. Here’s something interesting that reminded me of part of the superstuffed guide where you guys were saying we’ll soon just be slaves to the authority of marketing experts applying the science of persuasion—
My wife is taking a social psychology class online this semester since she just has to take random “advanced” level courses to finish her biology degree, and she just told me about this experiment they did in the 60s about obedience/authority, the Milgram experiment. I searched HSW.com and it turned up this brief mention of it– http://science.howstuffworks.com/10-science-experiments10.htm
You can actually view the experiment from videos posted on youtube. The ethics of this are extremely questionable. They wanted to see how far the average person would be willing to go to obey authority, under the premise that they were administering questions to a test subject (learner) who was to receive shocks for answering incorrectly. A “head experimenter” authority figure would be present in the room with the subjects, and instruct them to increase the voltage each time.
Some of the subjects went so far as to keep on going even after the learner became unresponsive, under instruction from the authority to treat not answering as incorrect. For the majority of the subjects, the learner (just an actor) was not in view, and they actually used a recording for the objections/pain yells/demands to be set free in order to control that factor’s effect on the subjects. Anytime the subjects would ask who was responsible for the learner’s safety, the authority figure in the room would say he was responsible. He would tell them they had no choice if they asked to stop, and tell them the experiment must continue.
I told my wife during my initial reaction that I believed that the best explanation for the behavior was fear of pain being inflicted by the authority figure for disobedience, even though no literal threat was ever issued. It made sense to me that the subjects who went furthest had the belief “what is this person going to do to me if I say no, since he is willing to have this person harmed by these escalating shocks?”
The interesting thing, which I had not known at the time I formulated that explanation, was that they observed an unexpected or unexplainable behavior in most of the subjects who did not refuse early in, which was nervous laughter sometimes leading to uncontrollable seizures. This seems to possibly further support the idea that the subjects became afraid of the head experimenter. In the videos, my wife tells me, the subjects were interviewed and those who laughed answered as to why they laughed that either they did not know why or would only say that it was certainly not because they had enjoyed it.
But, my wife believes the subjects never became cognizantly afraid of the authority figure. They became extremely uncomfortable after shocking the first time, but then had a hard time standing up to the authority figure in the confused and pressured state. They were in a state of extreme cognitive dissonance since they knew it was wrong to shock the learner but were following an instict-like behavior to try and appear competent. I found the study to be pretty sick. I wondered if it perhaps was an inspiration for some of the “tests” inflicted on people in the Saw films.
She was telling me about a personality trait called “need for cognition” which I believed was only present in those subjects who refused to proceed easily and resisted the authority. I think that very few people have this personality trait, causing them to be compelled to live the “examined life” and find new ways of thinking about and doing things. I think for the most part psychology is not exactly science. The experiment itself though attempting to follow the scientific method is flawed, as you guys have mentioned at times you just cannot practically study human behavior too well.
What do you think about this? I was raised in a certain “cult-like” religion in which authority was a heavy tactic used to try and control the members and get them to follow in some pretty ridiculous practices, among other propaganda, brainwashing, & other persuasion techniques. I think a full podcast about authority/obedience, social conformity, or actual brainwashing tactics would be very interesting as a followup to some of these ideas from the superstuffed guide & propaganda episode.”
I really enjoyed this week in SYSK podcasts. We had a darker podcast and a Light, Humorous one. I’d like to hear a few more “dark” subject podcasts (like the CIA LCD podcast or Cannibalism podcast).
thanks for the Show.
P.S. Because of the Twinkie Episode I actually ate my first Twinkie the next day.
just wanted to mention how much i love the boy meets world episode where shawn hunter joins a cult and then mr. turner gets in a motorcycle crash.
I saw an “unwrapped” episode on the food network. They devoted an entire hour to the wonderful twinkie. Their is a lady who makes homemade twinkies with “real” ingrediants and i think thats all she does. im not sure where she is located… i was pretty high, but i remember considering a road trip right then and there.
Melanie says: I loved the podasts! Keep up the good work Chuck and Josh!
i have a suggestion for a show. how attila the hun was a dwarf
Hey guys! Loved the podcast. Just wanted to let you know there are several baking blogs that have homemade versions of twinkies! This was one that I found http://www.joythebaker.com/blog/2008/06/homemade-twinkies/ you can always search http://foodblogsearch.com/ for more awesome homemade recipes like Girlscout cookies knock offs and other Hostess goodies. Careful, it’s dangerous!!
Andrea says: Since it’s now apparent that Twinkies SUCK, I’m sure the thoughts that follow won’t be unique, but they’re mine. What the hell.
What the hell happened to Twinkies? I remember them being fluffy golden bars of greasy cake, insomuch as something can be fluffy and greasy at the same time, but that is the Wonder and Beauty of Food Chemistry, and I am it’s adoring slave, worshiping at the CoolWhip Altar in the Frito-Lay All-Night Temple of Blue Food.
When I was a skinny twenty-something, my best friend and I would play Trivial Pursuit and backgammon into the wee hours of the morning, and then snarf down a coupla Twinkies with some diet 7-Up. This was sometimes accompanied by Fritos and bean dip, and always by a pack or two (each) of Kool Milds. Sometimes this was consumed in a van on the way to Mexico, but that’s another story.
You’d bite the end off, and unfurl your tongue into that greasy golden cakey cavern filled with creamy fabulousness. I remember the moment of dizzy bliss that followed, and at the time I believed I was being transported to some sort of junk food nirvana, but now I think it was merely the sugar and fat coursing toward my heart and giving me a mini-stroke.
Years passed. My best friend disappeared. No one wanted to play Trivial Pursuit anymore. I quit smoking. Other things replaced Twinkies.
Tonight I was in Albertson’s, buying cheese curds and frozen french fries, and stumbled across a tower of boxed Hostess products nestled in with the health food/dairy/produce/balloons/floral items. Twinkies appeared in my cart.
I ripped one open as soon as I got home, giddy with anticipation, already tasting the sweet greasy creamy cakey fabulousness…. and UGH. Disgusting. The greasy cakey outer barrier was now just a slippery waxy finish that looked like walls covered with yellow knockdown splatter. I was temporarily comforted by the familiar cream injection marks on the underbelly of my beloved Twinkie, but as it was nearly a full third smaller, the tiny inner cavern was too small to hold a respectable amount of creamy filling, never mind be properly tongue-navigated. And it felt wrong. What was once soft and supple was now firm and unyielding, like a nasty brick of third-degree tofu. Sigh.
Then I tasted it. So, so sad. The cake tasted like an old hotel pillow, dry and spongy. The cream tasted like that Carvel crap that they try to pass off as ice cream. Bleh!! I had another. Then another. Then another. Then another. (Empirical research.) The sixth one I accidentally dropped in the garbage as I was opening it, into the cheese curd/gravy/french fry coagulant from supper. It was a sign.
Josh Clark says: Hey Sara, I did indeed sell fried Twinkies at the EAV beer festival. Not this year, but the two before it. I’m glad you liked them because they are the most awesome thing ever created by humans.
Seth B. says: I have a different sort of brainwashing to speak of:
Years ago, when I was maybe in my young teens, my brother loaned me a CD called Orbvus Terrarvm containing a track called “White River Junction” wherein there is some clip of a self-help voice-over telling you how ‘worth-while you are’ etc. I used to listen to this CD all the time as I went to sleep, for years, off and on. Later, in high school, I came up with this nifty, original philosophy that interactions with people would be so much easier if we could all try to simply be “Open, honest, and direct” with each-other. Years later again, I popped that CD in again, only to be shocked to hear that exact phrase come out of the song. I couldn’t get over the fact that I had, apparently, conditioned myself (in my sleep)into a whole life philosophy.
does that seem like a relevant correltaion?
Ross says: Hey Josh, absolutely love the SYSK podcasts. I’m catching up today because I was in the hospital last week having mini-strokes as Andrea so eloquently spoke of already (not due to Twinkies, but I figured it would be a good tie-in). I know you guys mentioned Jonestown twice in two consecutive podcasts, but you only made what I consider to be a picky mistake in the Twinkie-cast. I promise I have no affiliation with the company, but I just want to let you and Chuckers know that it was not Kool-Aid that was used at Jonestown, it was Flavor-Aid. Not sure if anyone else cares to defend the Kool-Aid man, but they got a bad rep for being the most recognizable drink in that scenario. Thanks man – and again, I love everything you guys cover. Thanks for the laughs and education all at once!
Charles says: Hey Ross – thanks for the love, and uh, read the blog post above for the correction.
kate says: I don’t think it’s a cliche to hate mimes. I think it’s natural to hate strangers covered in makeup who make fun of you, or at least, do things that aren’t funny and want you to laugh and give them money. Yuck. It usually happens when you’re minding your own business, or talking to your friends in the park. There are just so many reasons to hate them.
Also… I think the twinkie experiment needs controls. The next person to do this should also use a piece of homemade cake and see how the two compare… judging by the amount of time I had a grocery store torte in my fridge last year… I think the results could be suprizing.
There is a video on Hulu that shows the production process of Twinkies.
http://www.hulu.com/watch/47236/man-made-sweet-tooth
Bradley says: Hey guys,
Great podcast you guys are putting out. I’m enjoying all the topics, and I’m always the one at events who’s got the random information about things like déjà vu, lucid dreaming, and cannibalism (as long as it’s not a dinner event)!
Thanks to your podcast about propaganda, and the conversation I then had with a friend about the subject, I finally picked up a copy of and read 1984. I was amazed to see and recognize all the propaganda throughout the book. Just about everything associated with the life of the main character was devoted to propagandizing Big Brother.
And then you guys put out this brainwashing podcast, and I couldn’t help but thinking of the last section of 1984. I actually went back through and read that part again, only to find exactly the tactics you both mentioned in the podcast! It’s almost like George Orwell drank some highly concentrated Vul Nut Wine (guess the reference w/o using google!), listened to your podcast, read Julia Layton’s article, then wrote the end of the book!
I think Josh said he was fascinated at a new age workshop that people were seeking out anything.
An old phrase I once learned says
“in an age of incredulity, people will be most credulous,”
so, in an age when traditional values, truths, etc. are disbelieved or attacked strongly, people will latch onto any novelty, superstition, etc.
I really enjoyed this podcast. Learning about brainwashing was like remembering my jaded past in certain (allegedly) “spiritual” congregations. I was glad that you didn’t bring it into a religious context, but the parallels are amazing, especially after having watched Jesus Camp. Since coercion is not necessarily involved for certain contexts, I suppose one could argue that (political/social/religious) indoctrination is brainwashing by choice.
Jessi says: Hey Chuck and Josh,
I love your podcast in general, but have a correction for your Twinkie show. You sidetracked from Twinkie The Kid to the other cowboy-hatted cartoon guy of the 80’s. The cheese guy in the cowboy hat has no pockets…what he says is ” I hanker for a hunka…a slab, a slice, ‘r chunka…I hanker for a hunka cheese!” That is a phrase I think of often, for some reason, and I thought you’d like to know!
Keep up the good work!
***jessi from South Dakota
I loved the Twinkies podcast, it was fun and made me laugh in my car this morning so no need to send thank yous Chuck! Sometime in the last 20 years they changed the cream in the Twinkies and Hostess cupcakes and now they just aren’t the same. They used to be Dee-lish!